And always, always, the nagging fear…
By · Comments“What woman drives away from the American dream and into a nomadic life?
How does she build community with other women travelers?
And when she can no longer travel, what happens then?
And always, always, the nagging fear:
‘Will anyone care about these stories?’
Will you?
About the Author:
Marion Orem lives in the southwest and has been hearing others’ voices for as long as she can remember. She’d like to hear yours. She’s learned that technical perfection is an endless quest – a quest that honors the voices of those who can no longer speak for themselves.
People communicate through digital technology today. I mean “… to give voice” and we mean to be heard.
Truthfully, Lovern’s independence was built on a foundation
free of a traditional mother’s expectations. Having few
demands made upon her as a daughter, she reciprocated with
no guilty feelings toward her mother. She also felt few qualms
about leaving a Christmas note in 1951: “By the time you read
this I will be married ….��?
Her mother’s reticence and need to keep close counsel shadows
Lovern to this day. “She was a strong woman, prone to speak
her mind …��? describes fairly both mother and daughter.
Lovern produces a wonderful photograph of a mother and
toddler striding down a Seattle street in 1937. The mother’s
progress is slowed by the toddler’s distraction at something
just beyond the camera’s range. Her mother’s ramrod straight
posture signals an early beacon for the daughter at her side.
“My strengths came from how I was raised …��? reinforces the
photograph’s cherished place on a bedroom wall. Still, whose
voice is it when Lovern speaks and whose eyes scrutinize what
she sees?
Asked what she admired most about her mother, Lovern
replies that it was her sense of humor. Once informed of a
neighbor’s dog, Betty Grable, Lovern’s quick inquiry echoes a
question her mother might have asked: “Does she have great
looking legs …?��?
No one is free of a mother’s influence. What role would that
influence play? Legacies beg to be explored because they are
who we are. Other voices need to be heard. Other daughters
need to be interviewed. Other legacies need to be shared.
Every mother’s influence shadows her daughter to this day.
Nancy Barnhart’s legacy is Lovern Root King. While Lovern
gratefully acknowledges her mother’s role, she resolutely cedes
little ground in her own contributions. Who among us can’t
respect that struggle?
I have always been fascinated by who people are, where
they come from and why they live on one side of the street
instead of the other.
That fascination led me to Lovern Root King. The photograph
led me to her mother, Nancy Barnhart. A passion for
communicating has guided me through a writing program
and has now propelled me into digital storytelling.
That passion comes from the authentic me. I want to meet other
daughters and ponder other photographs and record other
legacies.
Legacies provide opportunities for learning and while I am
an adequate whistler, Lovern has promised to teach me how
to spit.
Lovern Root King: Original Article Interview—1996
Marion: In Women Who RV, Volume II, I plan to explore more deeply
an idea that surfaced in 1996 during my first interview with
Lovern King for my final writing assignment with the Long
Ridge Writers Group: to inspire others to speak for those
who canno longer speak for themselves.
Will that idea identify a source of strength for these women who RV?
Lovern: “I feel sorry for most women of my generation who never
learned to whistle or spit,��? resort park co-founder Lovern Root
King says firmly as one who did. Professor Emeritus of the
Evergreen State College Olympia, Washington, she was the one
daughter in a family with three sons.
Stylish silver hair graced by distinctive earrings, she speaks
in a voice made patient by life’s adversities. “I was the only girl
in our neighborhood and I learned my physical limitations at
a young age.��?
Her hazel eyes having pierced six decades, she remembers
a tomboy challenged by boyish play. She was left daily to her
own devices by a mother with other priorities. She now sees
her legacy of independence was nurtured by periods of being
alone. What impact would that legacy have for Lovern and
others who know her?
Every mother’s influence shadows her daughter to this day.
Early photos capture a shy child at the frame’s edge, a
stranger in a divorced father’s new family. Lovern spent her
youth being shuffled between family members who were preoccupied
with their own concerns.
“I learned to rely on myself and not depend on anyone else,
although I always wanted a big sister.��?
Settled comfortably on her patio, she shares her mother
Nancy Barnhart’s memory. “She was a strong woman, prone to
speak her mind. She discouraged friendly relations with neighbors
and divorced in an era when other women did not.��?
Lost in thought, eyes blinking at a distant vision, moments
pass before Lovern returns with a reluctant start.
Shifting slightly, she speaks in a quiet voice. “I lived a life
that, by today’s standards, would be considered deprived. But
my strengths came from how I was raised.��?
Those strengths were developed in a relationship outside
the cultural norm. She laughs, with a quick catch in her throat,
about the annual chore of choosing a Mother’s Day card.
The cultural ideal of a nurturing, caring mother—a daughter’s
inspiration—was not quite the sentiment required.
I made a commitment to pursue my “…to give voice” passion
on Memorial Day 1994. I enrolled in a writing program with this
final 1996 interview assignment with Lovern King done the old
fashioned way…pen and paper.
Marion: I became a member of the Arizona Book Publishing
Association thanks to Laurie Fagen. No one there thinks I’m
crazy. They all just want to help.
My respect for the wisdom of “Ships are safe in the harbor,
but that’s not what ships are for …��? deepened as a result of my
ABPA membership.
The association’s members have taught me that I can live
safely along the shore. I just need to be in the right harbor.
Laurie has known about my “… to give voice��? commitment
Lyle Fagen.
Laurie: I’m Laurie Fagen and I’ve come to realize that mostly I’m
an entrepreneur.
I’m a writer, a fiber artist, an art gallery owner, a singer, and
a mother of a sixteen-year-old boy. I’m also a wife and have
been married for more than twenty years.
The stories that resonated most with me were Marion’s stories.
I’ve known her personally and professionally for thirteen
years. Over that time, I’ve watched her find her voice and her
place in this world.
She’s talked about wanting to make movies. I’m hopeful that
she’ll complete her goal of giving voice through storytelling by
including those important visuals to go along with the stories
only moving pictures can tell so well.
But you learn your storytelling skills first. She’s doing that
now. Once she’s accomplished that, I think those pictures will
certainly follow.
I would like to share a specific voice who can no longer speak
for herself. My paternal grandmother lived a full and happy
life until she was about 97. I hope I take after her.
She spoke volumes through her diaries. She kept them for
84 years. She was a farmer’s wife who raised two children. She
ran the farm for twenty years after my grandfather was killed
in a farming accident.
She lived on her own until she was 95 years old. I now have
most of her diaries. In fact, one of my long-term goals is to turn
them into a creative non-fiction book. I want to give voice to
her life story.
My grandmother’s name was Blanche Lyle Fagen. She was
just a dear person. She played piano. She sang.
One of her favorite quotes was by George Bernard Shaw. I
had the quote framed for her and I asked to have it back after
“Life is no brief candle to me. It is a sort of splendid torch
which I have got hold of for the moment. And I want to make
it shine as brightly as possible before handing it on to future
generations.��?
Just in closing, I think that life could be more fulfilling if
people could just do what they love to do. Be passionate about
what you love to do. Don’t take “No��? for an answer. Go around
that. There are a lot of crazy-makers in this world who are going
to tell you “No.��?
They are going to tell you, “No, that’s impossible. You can’t
do that.��? There’s that little editor sitting on your shoulder who
says, “What on earth are you thinking?��? You need to get past
that. Stick with the positive people in your life. Try everything
you can at least once.
Laurie recommended I join the Arizona Book Publishing
Association. Little did I know how critical that “community”
connection would become for my Women Who RV and a new
audio CD and book I’m now planning (working title):
“The Noble Art of the Printed Book through Social Media Publishing.”
Marion: Michael Rosenberger is a video production professional.
Media Mike, as I call him, proved to be invaluable to this project
with a steady flow of technical advice and periodic “Here’s
how you do that!��? solutions.
Mike drew on his outdoor and RVing passion and on his
commitment to share that passion with his family, with his
friends, and with these Women Who RV voices.
represents the core of Mike’s passion.
Media Mike: My name is Michael Rosenberger and I am the Video
Production Coordinator here at Phoenix College in Phoenix,
Arizona.
Marion came to our office with questions about a technology
project she was developing. She wanted to capture audio
and video digital stories about women who RV. I immediately
saw her as a kindred spirit.
I have a big passion for technology, video production specifically.
I was an outdoor journalist at one time. I knew that
My interest in video and the outdoors came at a very early
age. There was a TV show called On the Open Road that was
interview people about the history of those places. It really had
a personal touch.
I saw a parallel between the two when I listened to what
Marion had captured about the Women Who RV.
invitations to other family and friends to get them out into the
RV community so they can enjoy the experience.
That was a very important part of what Marion was trying to
do. I hope other people will hear the stories, read the book, and
see that there is a community for people who have that same
type of adventurous spirit. For people who want to be out there
on the open road, this project provides a way to understand
that they could be part of that community as well.
“Media” Mike recorded his interview in video while I
decided to use the audio portion for the CD. Digital
storytelling is not for the faint of heart. Resources
like Mike make the journey professionally feasible.
Marion: Diana Hoyt has been a key resource for this project. She
Women Who RV journey. She and her staff offered a safe haven
Diana drew a telling link between the Women Who RV and
a note of joy and a hint of sadness.
Julia Cameron’s the Artist’s Way was a book Diana used to
that book to found Authentic Voices Productions.
Diana’s right. Life is about choices. the Artist’s Way offers
make the choices those dreams will require.
Diana: I’m Diana Hoyt and I’m president and founder of Heritage
Designs. I design fundraising software for non-profit organizations.
I’m a proponent of fundraising and the use of technology
for non-profits to help them to do a better job of raising money.
I’m a firm believer that non-profits weave the fibers that make
our communities stronger communities.
I had an opportunity to listen to the Women Who RV voices.
advice, independence and spunk. I truly hope that when I grow
up I am just like them.
I was also a little saddened. I wish my mom had done what
these ladies did. She would have been in her element. She was
so intelligent and such a forceful person. She raised five kids.
I would have loved for her to have met these women and to
have been a part of their lives. It would have been great for
them and for her.
Marion and I met a number of years ago. She was building
Authentic Voices Productions. I was developing Heritage
Designs. One of the things we discovered was that we had both
read the Artist’s Way by Julia Cameron. We don’t know of many
It was recommended to me by a professional coach. I did
what it said to do. I started journaling in the morning. I tried to
do some of the play activities. I wasn’t very successful at that.
I don’t play a lot.
The book really helped me and set me on a course of personal
growth. The book and its influence was something Marion
and I shared.
I hear people grumbling that life is so difficult, that life is so
hard. No, life is about choices. You may be going through
I’m going through an extremely challenging time with my
business growth right now. I can sit back and do nothing. Or,
I can get off my duff, as one of the Women Who RV voices said.
One of the things we learn as we grow older is that it really
is about choices. You can take action. You can do something.
Or, you can just let life roll over you—and it will—but I like
the challenge and I like the choice.
A sense of community can lead to shared dreams
and mutual support when you take the opportunity
to move beyond professional connections only.
“We cannot be alone. You have to relate to something, someone,
there’s no community. Community is the thing that makes you
alive. Community is what enriches you. Your connection to the
outside world is where you become who you are.��?
Marion: The following five Kindred Spirits’ voices are my connection
Their interviews honor these Women Who RV voices. They
to inspire others to speak for those who can no longer speak
for themselves.
Marge Graver shared her experience and her support of this
project. To the casual observer, she was the last person likely
to drive away in an RV.
Chicago born, a south side Irish Catholic, and the oldest of
eight, she enjoyed a successful banking career before walking
who fit that profile, or one very much like it, who would ask:
“How did Marge do it?��?
She drew on the independence gifted to her by her mother,
Betty Connor Graver.
Marge: My name is Marge Graver. I was born and raised
development mainframe computers.
I was laid off in 1985 and decided I might as well
make a big change and move to Phoenix. Marion and
I were partners in a printing business. We sold the
business in 1993, bought a 34-foot Bounder motorhome,
and started a wholesale video business. We
traveled around the state of Arizona.
Marion: As you know, I always wanted to interview Betty Connor
In fact, this project idea started with her. Do you think she
saw a bit of Betty Connor in you when you left?
Marge: She has been gone now for over ten years. I was
one of the reasons I was able to easily move from
Chicago to Phoenix.
Marge: She graduated from high school in 1935 and went
school. She shared a car with her two brothers in the
late 1930s. I think that’s probably very unusual for
the Depression. She apparently made good enough
money to do that.
Washington, D.C. but her father said “No.��? Now my
father didn’t tell me that when I came to Phoenix.
Marion: Your mother struck me as very independent. I always sensed
was Betty Connor. How did her gift of independence get
you to Phoenix?
Marge: I think she contributed to the move. One reason I
I wanted to get away from Chicago and everybody
who always saw me as one thing or another.
This move was more of a freedom to be whatever I
wanted to be.
Marion: Do you think she saw a bit of Betty Connor in you when
Marge: We never talked about that. I’m not sure she would
get up and go.
Marion: Did any of the voices you heard on Volume I resonate
Marge: I have known each of them personally for fifteen
most. Her thoughts came from the heart. She was
very open and that’s the Ruth I know.
Marion: What is the one thing you wished you’d known before
have stopped you?
Marge: I think there are actually two things. The first is not
makes a big difference. The other thing is to appreciate
the commitment to leveling in a parking space, to
hooking up to the gray and black water dumps and
then unhooking the RV. It wouldn’t have stopped
me however.
Marge: I’ve gone back and forth on that. I’m still working full
about being able to travel someplace for a month or
three months and just park and be there.
Marion: I want to thank you for your time and for allowing me to
Ruth’s thoughts on community linked these Kindred Spirit
voices with the Women Who RV interviews. I assumed the
Narrator’s role not knowing at the time that Marty Hanus
would request his interview be available by audio CD and
book only. Hence, the book’s new dedication and the link
to those who can no longer speak for themselves…
Sally: You shed the whole Chicago scene and the corporate gig
between you and that move and the RV people you’re
interested in who do the same thing: “I’m sick of this world
and I’m doing this.��?
Marion: When we moved out here, we bought a business
we still don’t, but we keep going. The business was
in printing. It was a distributorship and it was part
of a franchise.
One of my printers had a sign in his office window.
It was one of those laser wood things, a 19th century
ship, in full sail, and underneath it said,
“Ships are safe in the harbor, but that’s not what
ships are for.��?
If there’s one point that helped me understand
why I finally had to get out of corporate America,
it’s that I was safe in corporate Chicago, but that’s
not my remaining life’s work.
I had it all and it came to mean absolutely nothing.
I wanted to move; I wanted to live out West. I’d
always wanted to live out West and now I do. I had
to leave corporate America in order to survive.
Sally: It’s a nice cap on this interview: the piece about a ship in
That analogy to your own life’s work: If you just follow the
story, here you are. This is where you are, and you are not
safe inside or outside of corporate America.
Marion: No. No, I am not safe. That’s where the fear is. I wake
‘What the heck are you doing?’ The only thing
that keeps me going is: ‘You could stop. And then
what? That’s not what you’re meant to do.’
Many people live their lives safe along the shore.
There’s nothing wrong with that way of living. I just
can’t do that.
Other people think, ‘Well, you’re just wild-eyed
radicals, you entrepreneurs.’ No, we’re not. We’ll do
our homework, we’ll do our research, and there’s a
point where we’ll accept the fact that you really can’t
see the future. The only way to get there is to go.
Otherwise, you live today and you don’t leave the
shore when you’re capable of leaving it. You either
don’t leave the shore, or you live out on the ship. It
would be nice to come into shore once in a while.
It’s not about Marion; it’s not about Authentic
Voices Productions. It’s about getting the stories. If we
don’t get our own stories, no one else is going to.
Sally does a professional interview wrap-up here
by linking her closing questions back to the opening
“…fear” that I face every day. A fear my Mother would
have respected.
Marion: My goal is to capture the stories of these women who
them—a strength they may not see themselves.
Sally: They are unique.
brings us back to your mom, of course. And in one of your
podcasts you talk about watching her tap dance. I love that.
I love the visual that evokes. It would be wonderful right
now—because so much of this is based on your mom and
your relationship with her—if you could talk about how
her strength got to you.
Marion: That’s an interesting term to use about her. I don’t
she was strong. She was a military wife.
It was my mother who put us on a train and took
us out from Tennessee to New York City to get on
a ship. We went down the East Coast through the
Panama Canal up to San Francisco, where we picked
up the rest of the military families and sailed to
days. She loved it. She was a very strong woman.
Marion: Yes. She was a role model and she loved me unconditionally.
But it’s the feeling and the empathy about me that
people react to that I think comes from my mother.
If you view that as a strength—and I guess you
would—yes, then definitely.
Sally: Talk about how all that personal history had an impact on
Marion: The community of RVing women taught me what
you have absolutely no sense of ethnic groups. I say
this to people all the time and they laugh at me, but
it’s true. I have to be told, “That person‘s Jewish, that
person’s Polish, that person’s Italian.��?
Marion: As if it should matter, but to some people it does.
richness—I don’t have that in my background.
So when I got into the RV world, I realized there’s
a community there. Ruth Silver talks about that in her
interview and she has a lot more experience. I began
to realize, ‘You know, I’m missing something. I’m not
part of something.’ Out here in Phoenix that’s one
of the major negatives; everybody lives behind their
walls and they’re all from some other place.
So the sense of community became critical to me.
But ironically enough, the community for me came
back to the RV world. I couldn’t let those stories go.
There was a need for the audio and book to include a
Narrator’s role that connected these Women Who RV
voices. Sally’s interview with me was one of the last things
she had to finish before she and Jan hit the rving road.
However, the transition of going from a coupled
life with a lot of community around you to then being
alone was a difficult one for me. We come into this
earth alone and we go out alone.
I was now by myself and became Ruth Silver.
That’s when I realized that I do function and that
there are people aware of who I am and what my
contribution to the community has been.
That was my rebirth and it freed me to become a
different person somehow, and that’s a very difficult
thing for me to explain.
To be not a different person, but to be the same
person and have all that wonderment of what has
happened in the past. I’m still in the transition and I’m
still in the process. There is something that lies ahead
for me. I have no idea what it is, but I am free.
There was a kind of freedom that was different
from graduating, different from being divorced, different
from leaving a mate. It was a very different
sense of identity. One that was quite different from
being alone in the world and being fearful: “Oh my,
I’m by myself.��?
That was not my sense of being alone and being
free. My sense of being alone and being free was like
taking a deep breath for the first time.
It’s hard to pick up when that feeling was almost
a spiritual experience. I realized I was not religious.
I was a very spiritual human being. I knew that
there was great depth to my being. I was aware that
it didn’t matter what ritual I preferred. You come
alive regardless and you awaken some inner being
that we all have but are not able to touch.
I felt very aware and very awake. I didn’t feel like
I was a different person. I felt like I was a rekindled
person. I became more aware of who I really was.
I seem to be going off on all kinds of tracks here.
you got me thinking. I feel that I’m very much
awake and alive at this point in my life.
It’s because I’m aware and awake and rekindled
and concerned. I know it’s not forever. I also know
there will be an end. I don’t know how the end will
be, but it’s going to be a good time.
We cannot be alone. You have to relate to
something, someone, some place, somehow. And if
you have no sense of relatedness, there’s no community.
Community is the thing that makes you
alive. Community is what enriches you. Your connection
to the outside world is where you become who you are.
Ruth’s voice and comments were THE key catalysts
to produce both an audio and book version of these
Women Who RV interviews. “We cannot be alone…”
gracefully guided this effort to a far more universal
voice for all listeners and readers.
